Topic
Delaying Zerg's natural with a pylon?
When your probe is going to die. +1 if you manage to get your probe out before it dies. +2 if you manage to build a cybernetics core at the nat right before the pylon is destroyed. +3 if you manage to finish researching hallucination at the cybernetics core at the opponent's nat before he takes it down |
+4 if you research warpgate tech. My question remains unanswered: Why try so hard to delay the expansion, at the cost of your own econ/tech? |
Technically that was 2 base, just one of them was in my main... :P
It doesn't force 1base, it just delays the expo. Is that delay cost-effective enough that I should actually work an expansion-blocking pylon into my build? |
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What else is the Zerg going to spend money on? Every second the hatchery is delayed is time that his money is banking up to no purpose. He has to wait for lings to come out (your nexus has started already) or take a significantly harder-to-defend 2nd base, which means he has to over-invest on lings and/or spines and you're ahead by default.
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If I was Zerg I would plan faster gas timings if my expansion was blocked with a pylon, so that I can tech faster. Is it normal for zerg to just derp around letting their money stockpile when their expo is blocked? |
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I get people placing down a pylon at my natural all the time, but personally I think its a waste of time. It all depends on what build the zerg is doing, if they go hatch first then its definitely worth it but I go pool first every zvp so at most the pylon delays my expansion 10secs and costs you 100 minerals. And if you are ffe then I'm going to take a fast 3rd and then the pylon delays nothing at all as I'll just place my second at my third position. So in my opinion if the zerg goes pool first its a waste of time.
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I mainly play zerg and when I verse protoss I always go 11pool 18 hatch. My second overlord scouts the natural, so any pylons down there will be taken down with the zerglings before I'm even ready to expand.
Works pretty well against 15 hatch though. I see that as too vulnerable to toss however. |
Tech as fast as you like, your larvae output is capped. I'm more worried about how effectively you can drone.
Yeah, if the Z goes pool first then you can just use the probe to block until lings are out, throwing down (and cancelling) a pylon if the probe is taking too much damage. |
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Placing a Pylon or two at the nearest expansion for a Zerg can stop the chance of early expansion for at least 1 or 2 minutes game time.
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True but the 11pool 18 hatch strategy works in such a way that economy is still very close regardless. At the 6 minute mark both strategies start to look similar in economy. |
If he doesn't you gotta watch out, he's probably doing 1-base all-in.
You don't need two, 1 at the nat and hold position your probe at the third.
You are sacrificing economy for tech. By the time you started your hatch the protoss who went FFE would have his nexus almost completed, or if he went 3gate sentry expand he would have the nexus around the same timing as yours. |
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Edited by Decept on 3/18/12 9:32 PM (PDT)
The true art of pvz lies in the protss able to beat the zerg without denying the expansion, i truly respect those protosses. It usually only happens if the protoss has completely countered the zerg's build,
but most protosses think that they can delay another player's economy without sacrificing their own, and a pylon, really isn't much to sacrifice when delaying a hatchery, but if you are FFEing, it is just as easy for them to expand else where. Experienced zerg players are not gonna let you kill a free fast third. and if you are putting on pressure while FFe expanding (expecially nexus first), trying to take that fast third down, you are sacrificing just as much economy if you don't take it down. However it will put you ahead if you do take it down. but that lead is not sustainable if you don't do more damage immediately, or go the right build to counter, or lose your army due to the mass peak production of units that the zerg is doing to defend his third. |
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Edited by Graboid on 3/20/12 6:53 PM (PDT)
Doesn't a strong 2-based timing attack from the protoss do well against zerg? I'm pretty sure the attack comes before any benefit is taken by the zergs third expansion. If you can hit before mutalisks are in large numbers it's very hard to hold as a zerg.
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Dem Roaches broski. |
